Video Game Violence and it's effects on our youth.

[jxspyder]

Yes, this is a blatant rip off of Corey's thread. But no, it's not serving the same purpose. I really wanted to respond to something that Sam had said, but that thread is not the right venue for a discussion. Hence this one.

I'm going to do my best to call in, but regardless, here's my take.

Video games are like any other form of entertainment. Just like a book, movie, play, or painting. And just like all of these, it's our responsibility to ensure that a child's experiences in these are guided. Do you let your kid watch Braveheart or We Were Soldiers? Then why do you plop him in front of Call of Duty?

Parents have a responsibility to ensure that their children learn to separate fantasy from reality. It's part of that whole "right and wrong" discussion.


As far as overly gory........I absolutely disagree that there is something wrong with those games, or movies, or tv shows. I do believe, however, that parents need to stop using games and tv as a babysitter, and take a more active role in raising their child.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[toby2533]

read my response on the current parenting skills that are causing this shit in the other thread.

[Rickety Rob]

I agree with everything you said Spyder. Its up to the parents to make the decisions and to direct their child/ren towards. I believe video games are not the cause to why children become violent. If so, blame movies and so forth. I think personally kids find violence in areas such as school, the playground, their friends, and their parents who fight with one another

[iamthesgt]

Yep. Video Games are just one small part. It doesn't do kids any good to only pay attention to one segment of their life. The TV is a terrible babysitter, to be sure.

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[comanche_warior]

I totally agree I dont know how we have gotten to the society where we blame everybody for our problems. I talked about this with my mom today on our way home from shopping in Fresno. We both agreed that this society has turned into a bunch of pansy asses. I have only seen in the past 10 years or so that parents arent raising their kids anymore they are being thrown infront of the tv which no kid needs to be staring at unless its sports lol. I watched some very violent movies as a kid, I dont think I have turned out violent I dont go and start fights and stuff like that. I was raised to never start a fight but to sure as hell finish one. Parents just arent raising their kids to where they know how they should act in society. But in todays society its somebody elses fault and you have to change not the person who has the problem. The biggest thing that I have seen change is the attitude and discipline I got my ass whooped when I did something wrong and after the 5th time I learned what I could and couldnt do. I dont know where we got in the mindset that we cant discipline our kids there is a big difference between abuse and discipline but when we allow children to do whatever they want without consequences is when they turn into monsters in my opinion. I also have only seen in the past ten years that you cant do things because somebody will get offended. My philosophy is you dont like it either look the other way or leave but dont take my right away to do it. That goes for guns video games music movies and religion, not allowing the pledge of allegiance to be said in schools because it has God in it is horrible. Im sorry but if you dont like it tough shit either ignore it or shut up.

[Bull3tBait]

I dont know where we got in the mindset that we cant discipline our kids there is a big difference between abuse and discipline but when we allow children to do whatever they want without consequences is when they turn into monsters in my opinion.

This happened when little do-gooders started taking vids of people spanking kids (bad vids where you can't really see what's really going on) and sending them in to news stations who in turn aired them for the world to see (we didnt have youtube in those day. not sure if we even had internet yet). These news stations of course made it look look these parents were beating the living daylights out of the child. This in turn brings out all the "specialists" who say this type of discipline is harmful and causes kids to be psychopaths later in life. Then you have kids that were spanked coming forward saying they were scared for life and a bunch or parents terrified to spank their kids. I saw it unfold on TV and I just knew nothing good was going to come from it.




There Ain't no Rest for the Wicked.....

[iamthesgt]

This happened when little do-gooders started taking vids of people spanking kids (bad vids where you can't really see what's really going on) and sending them in to news stations who in turn aired them for the world to see (we didnt have youtube in those day. not sure if we even had internet yet). These news stations of course made it look look these parents were beating the living daylights out of the child. This in turn brings out all the "specialists" who say this type of discipline is harmful and causes kids to be psychopaths later in life. Then you have kids that were spanked coming forward saying they were scared for life and a bunch or parents terrified to spank their kids. I saw it unfold on TV and I just knew nothing good was going to come from it.

Yep. I got my ass tore up a few times but it was good for me. People like that piss me off.

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[RogueScot]

This in turn brings out all the "specialists" who say this type of discipline is harmful and causes kids to be psychopaths later in life.

This is total BS. I had my ass whipped many, many times when I was a kid. I deserved every single one. I didn't turn out to be a psychopath, but I learned there were consequences for my actions.

I walked by a woman with a kid in a department store a few years ago. He was being a total shit. As I walked by his mother told him, "I've told you five times already. If you do it again, you're going to get a time out." I couldn't stand it. I turned around and told her, "Lady, beat his ass!" She was horrified and I walked on. :)

[iamthesgt]

I walked by a woman with a kid in a department store a few years ago. He was being a total shit. As I walked by his mother told him, "I've told you five times already. If you do it again, you're going to get a time out." I couldn't stand it. I turned around and told her, "Lady, beat his ass!" She was horrified and I walked on. :)

Good for you!

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[HAVOK]

I can't stand the fact that American Politicians and even some Parents name video games for what's wrong with their kids. If the Parents did their fucking job then we wouldn't have these mentally misguided Tweens running around thinking its ok to kill somebody just because they got the last fucking Mountain Dew in the machine. Come on, take some motherfucking responsibility for your children and do right by them. I'm with Rogue, if I screwed up, I was told so. If I screwed up again, I got the belt. And guess what? I didn't do that anymore. Consequences and repercussions.
Video games have once again become the scapegoat for violence in America, when its clearly failure on the Parents part. The Govt. will use this sickening event in Newtown to fuel ignorance not only of gun ownership and our 2nd amendment rights, but I feel like they'll also try "cracking down" into our beloved game industry as well. It's only a matter of time before the bullshit starts all over again.

[Rickety Rob]

I can't stand the fact that American Politicians and even some Parents name video games for what's wrong with their kids. If the Parents did their fucking job then we wouldn't have these mentally misguided Tweens running around thinking its ok to kill somebody just because they got the last fucking Mountain Dew in the machine. Come on, take some motherfucking responsibility for your children and do right by them. I'm with Rogue, if I screwed up, I was told so. If I screwed up again, I got the belt. And guess what? I didn't do that anymore. Consequences and repercussions.
Video games have once again become the scapegoat for violence in America, when its clearly failure on the Parents part. The Govt. will use this sickening event in Newtown to fuel ignorance not only of gun ownership and our 2nd amendment rights, but I feel like they'll also try "cracking down" into our beloved game industry as well. It's only a matter of time before the bullshit starts all over again.

But if the parents didn't blame others for their kids behavior...then who would they blame. Themselves? HELL NO! Why? Because then they would be critized to be a bad parent and who would want to have that on their concious.

[comanche_warior]

These news stations of course made it look look these parents were beating the living daylights out of the child.


This in turn brings out all the "specialists" who say this type of discipline is harmful and causes kids to be psychopaths later in life.

There Ain't no Rest for the Wicked.....

Not sure how to do the multi quote yet so bear with me here. Thats the same with showing the videos of the bus drivers beating the hell out of a kid. They dont show the times before that when the kid is being a total shit.

Like my psychology teacher said "Anybody can be a behavior specialist" He said those books that teach you how you can turn your childs attitude around in three days are a crock of shit because the writer the "professional" and the sponsors are all the same person.

[HAVOK]

But if the parents didn't blame others for their kids behavior...then who would they blame. Themselves? HELL NO! Why? Because then they would be critized to be a bad parent and who would want to have that on their concious.

Yep, it's certainly better than being known as the Parents of a sociopathic murderer....

[iamthesgt]

Yep, it's certainly better than being known as the Parents of a sociopathic murderer....

True, but Rob's point is spot-on.

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[jxspyder]

Yep, it's certainly better than being known as the Parents of a sociopathic murderer....

Yep, because then they're the victim.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[BilgeRatBilly]

All I really have to say on the topic is that parents need to sac up and take some responsibility. Being a parent is a lot of work and probably 80% of Americans aren't willing to do it. Stop blaming other people or objects for you're own failures. Spend some time with your kids... Stop working or just being lazy and get involved in their lives. That would solve most of the problems we have.

Sent from the bra where I'm enjoying my 3 a day!

[HAVOK]

All I really have to say on the topic is that parents need to sac up and take some responsibility. Being a parent is a lot of work and probably 80% of Americans aren't willing to do it. Stop blaming other people or objects for you're own failures. Spend some time with your kids... Stop working or just being lazy and get involved in their lives. That would solve most of the problems we have.

Sent from the bra where I'm enjoying my 3 a day!

This^^^

[comanche_warior]

All I really have to say on the topic is that parents need to sac up and take some responsibility. Being a parent is a lot of work and probably 80% of Americans aren't willing to do it. Stop blaming other people or objects for you're own failures. Spend some time with your kids... Stop working or just being lazy and get involved in their lives. That would solve most of the problems we have.

Sent from the bra where I'm enjoying my 3 a day!

agreed

[Rickety Rob]

Nothing wrong with throwing the pig skin or baseball around. I miss those days. I can't wait to have kids so I can do those things with them.

[jxspyder]

Nothing wrong with throwing the pig skin or baseball around. I miss those days. I can't wait to have kids so I can do those things with them.

Get a dog. It's so much easier........

:p

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[Rickety Rob]

Get a dog. It's so much easier........

:p

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

Hahahaha! I'll have one or two of those for the rest of my life. I would assume you have a dog then. Is the dog the go to when it comes to bothering dad when dad is playing video games lol?

[jxspyder]

Hahahaha! I'll have one or two of those for the rest of my life. I would assume you have a dog then. Is the dog the go to when it comes to bothering dad when dad is playing video games lol?

No, I have a kid. I'd rather have the dog sometimes......

:p

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[Rickety Rob]

No, I have a kid. I'd rather have the dog sometimes......

:p

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

Hahahaha! Dogs are a whole lot cheaper lol

[GhostOverride]

I'm bringing this thread back to the surface. So apparently Saints Row 4 will be releasing in Australia with a low violence version of the original game. Here is some info from Joystiq


Volition's enforced rework of Saints Row 4 for Australia looks to be a "Low Violence" edition, at least according to the game's Steam page for the country. There are no details on what exact changes make the violence "Low" enough to satisfy the Aussie ratings' board, so we've reached out to publisher Deep Silver for clarification.

Last month, Saints Row 4 became the first game to be refused Australia's R18+ rating, which was introduced on January 1 - State of Decay soon became the second. An "alien anal probe," posited as a "visual depiction of implied sexual violence that is interactive," and the involvement of illicit drug use were cited as the two main reasons for the ban.


I understand that a country has the right to regulate what it lets into the country, but how do you think this would go over in the US. Personally I think that the publishers have the right to make what they want and fit it into the current rating system that we have but at some point it must fall on the parents and I'm tired of hearing the video game industry being blamed for violence in kids. I am a proud child of the Nintendo generation and while games have become more graphic over the years I know it is my responsibility to ensure my 9yr old knows that games are not real! Enough already.

[NwG_SnakeEyes]

I'm bringing this thread back to the surface. So apparently Saints Row 4 will be releasing in Australia with a low violence version of the original game. Here is some info from Joystiq



I understand that a country has the right to regulate what it lets into the country, but how do you think this would go over in the US. Personally I think that the publishers have the right to make what they want and fit it into the current rating system that we have but at some point it must fall on the parents and I'm tired of hearing the video game industry being blamed for violence in kids. I am a proud child of the Nintendo generation and while games have become more graphic over the years I know it is my responsibility to ensure my 9yr old knows that games are not real! Enough already.

Agreed. I did a paper on this for college taking the stance that its not the violence of games to blame but shitty parenting is.


Taking time away from Achievement Hunting to post via Tapatalk 2

[Rickety Rob]

Way to bring back the dead

[iamthesgt]

Way to bring back the dead

The Necromancer!

[BilgeRatBilly]

In general I completely agree that it's on the parents and individual to police themselves with violence and graphic material in games, but I also don't have a problem with having moral absolutes. If the game had (what I read as) essentially anal rape I sure as he'll wouldn't want the game and wouldn't allow my children to pay it either. I'm not here to be the moral police but I believe there has to be a line somewhere. Graphic, violent, sexual abuse seems like a good place to start to me.

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

[jgreco138]

Seems pretty ironic since Australia was a penal colony a few hundred years ago.

[iamthesgt]

In general I completely agree that it's on the parents and individual to police themselves with violence and graphic material in games, but I also don't have a problem with having moral absolutes. If the game had (what I read as) essentially anal rape I sure as he'll wouldn't want the game and wouldn't allow my children to pay it either. I'm not here to be the moral police but I believe there has to be a line somewhere. Graphic, violent, sexual abuse seems like a good place to start to me.

Agreed. Shoot-em-up games, especially where there is a clear objective (i.e. a military campaign), I don't think can have near the effect on people that graphic sexual content can, especially younger children. (but because I'm a libertarian by leaning I don't want the government interfering with the guidelines or laws about it).

[comanche_warior]

In general I completely agree that it's on the parents and individual to police themselves with violence and graphic material in games, but I also don't have a problem with having moral absolutes. If the game had (what I read as) essentially anal rape I sure as he'll wouldn't want the game and wouldn't allow my children to pay it either. I'm not here to be the moral police but I believe there has to be a line somewhere. Graphic, violent, sexual abuse seems like a good place to start to me.

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

I completely agree with what you are saying.

[GhostOverride]

In general I completely agree that it's on the parents and individual to police themselves with violence and graphic material in games, but I also don't have a problem with having moral absolutes. If the game had (what I read as) essentially anal rape I sure as he'll wouldn't want the game and wouldn't allow my children to pay it either. I'm not here to be the moral police but I believe there has to be a line somewhere. Graphic, violent, sexual abuse seems like a good place to start to me.

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

I'm not saying I agree with the inclusions of excessively imoral content, but that's why we now have a rating system. Parents need to read about what they are buying there kids and what they are letting them play. As an adult if I want to buy a game where hamsters are being thrown at prostitutes for bonus points I have that right. I'm just tired of everyone putting the blame somewhere else instead of starting at home. For all things holy take some accountability.

[jxspyder]

In general I completely agree that it's on the parents and individual to police themselves with violence and graphic material in games, but I also don't have a problem with having moral absolutes. If the game had (what I read as) essentially anal rape I sure as he'll wouldn't want the game and wouldn't allow my children to pay it either. I'm not here to be the moral police but I believe there has to be a line somewhere. Graphic, violent, sexual abuse seems like a good place to start to me.

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

But since you're not the moral police, its not your place to say that the game is unnacceptable and should be completely removed......only that it's unnacceptable for your kid to play, making you solely reaponsible for whether or not he experiences it.

How is graphic, violent, sexual abuse somehow more innappropriate for a child than graphic, violent, physical abuse? Extremely excessive gore? Excessive mental/emotional abuse?

Theres already a line that exists. Its called active parenting. Governmental oversight not required.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[jxspyder]

Agreed. Shoot-em-up games, especially where there is a clear objective (i.e. a military campaign), I don't think can have near the effect on people that graphic sexual content can, especially younger children. (but because I'm a libertarian by leaning I don't want the government interfering with the guidelines or laws about it).

Because graphic violence and gore is somehow more acceptable than graphic sex?

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[jxspyder]

I'm not saying I agree with the inclusions of excessively imoral content, but that's why we now have a rating system. Parents need to read about what they are buying there kids and what they are letting them play. As an adult if I want to buy a game where hamsters are being thrown at prostitutes for bonus points I have that right. I'm just tired of everyone putting the blame somewhere else instead of starting at home. For all things holy take some accountability.

+1. Parents need to start being accountable as parents.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[NwG_SnakeEyes]

+1. Parents need to start being accountable as parents.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

Agreed. Too often they are looking to put the blame on someone or something else. If my child does something wrong, it is something I didn't convey properly, not the fact that I let them play graphic video games


Taking time away from Achievement Hunting to post via Tapatalk 2

[iamthesgt]

Because graphic violence and gore is somehow more acceptable than graphic sex?

Ah, but I did not say graphic violence and gore, did I? I stated that shooting, which is not as graphic, as say, beating someone with a club, was more acceptable.


+1. Parents need to start being accountable as parents.

Agree to this 1000%

[jgreco138]

+1. Parents need to start being accountable as parents.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

I feel the same way, but you have to realize that society has made it so you don't have to be responsible for your own actions anymore. Burn your mouth on some coffee? That's the stores fault for not warning you that your hot coffee is hot. Your crazy kid shoots up a school? That's the guns fault. The list goes on.

[BilgeRatBilly]

Theres already a line that exists. Its called active parenting. Governmental oversight not required.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

That is correct when applied properly. The problem with that is not all parents are active nor do they give a shit what their kids see/do. Perhaps all people could govern themselves if they were as awesome as we are. But people suck, so we can't; that's why we have laws.

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

[iamthesgt]

I feel the same way, but you have to realize that society has made it so you don't have to be responsible for your own actions anymore. Burn your mouth on some coffee? That's the stores fault for not warning you that your hot coffee is hot. Your crazy kid shoots up a school? That's the guns fault. The list goes on.

I'd point out that the McDonald's hot coffee case (I presume that's what you are referencing, if not, my bad) was not irresponsibility on the part of the consumer, but rather McDonald's clear negligence.

http://www.caoc.org/index.cfm?pg=facts


(I'd also point out, as a completely irrelevant fact, that it apparently happened recently too: http://www.inquisitr.com/826677/mcdonalds-hot-coffee-lawsuit-yes-another-one (http://www.inquisitr.com/826677/mcdonalds-hot-coffee-lawsuit-yes-another-one/))

[iamthesgt]

That is correct when applied properly. The problem with that is not all parents are active nor do they give a shit what their kids see/do. Perhaps all people could govern themselves if they were as awesome as we are. But people suck, so we can't; that's why we have laws.

No. We have laws to protect people from each other, not from themselves. If you are an abusive parent, you should be removed. But if you're just an idiot, why does the government get to say you can't have your children or you can/can't do X,Y, and Z with your children. The potential for overstepping bounds is extremely high there. That's called censorship.

[BilgeRatBilly]

I'd point out that the McDonald's hot coffee case (I presume that's what you are referencing, if not, my bad) was not irresponsibility on the part of the consumer, but rather McDonald's clear negligence.

http://www.caoc.org/index.cfm?pg=facts


(I'd also point out, as a completely irrelevant fact, that it apparently happened recently too: http://www.inquisitr.com/826677/mcdonalds-hot-coffee-lawsuit-yes-another-one (http://www.inquisitr.com/826677/mcdonalds-hot-coffee-lawsuit-yes-another-one/))

How did you find that? Were you doing a research paper?

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

[jxspyder]

Ah, but I did not say graphic violence and gore, did I? I stated that shooting, which is not as graphic, as say, beating someone with a club, was more acceptable.



Agree to this 1000%


Then why would you compare graphic sex to non-graphic violence?

I'd disagree that one is more acceptable than the other. Is Mario more graphic than CoD? Its an obviously extreme example, but its the basis of your point here.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[RogueScot]

Then why would you compare graphic sex to non-graphic violence?

I'd disagree that one is more acceptable than the other. Is Mario more graphic than CoD? Its an obviously extreme example, but its the basis of your point here.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

Wait...Mario had graphic sex in it? :)

[jxspyder]

That is correct when applied properly. The problem with that is not all parents are active nor do they give a shit what their kids see/do. Perhaps all people could govern themselves if they were as awesome as we are. But people suck, so we can't; that's why we have laws.

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

We have laws to protect from others. Sam hit it on the head. This is basic censorship.

Put it this way. Do you think tv shows like Spartacus, Game of Thrones, or True Blood should be banned? What about movies like 300, Black Swan, or American History X? Should they be banned as well? How are they any different?

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[jgreco138]

I'd point out that the McDonald's hot coffee case (I presume that's what you are referencing, if not, my bad) was not irresponsibility on the part of the consumer, but rather McDonald's clear negligence.

http://www.caoc.org/index.cfm?pg=facts


(I'd also point out, as a completely irrelevant fact, that it apparently happened recently too: http://www.inquisitr.com/826677/mcdonalds-hot-coffee-lawsuit-yes-another-one (http://www.inquisitr.com/826677/mcdonalds-hot-coffee-lawsuit-yes-another-one/))

It's still their fault. A paper cup of hot coffee belongs in a cup holder, not between your knees.

[jxspyder]

Wait...Mario had graphic sex in it? :)

Hell yeah. Sex, drugs, and rock and roll. Thats what Mario was all about. :rolleyes::cool:

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[BilgeRatBilly]

We have laws to protect from others. Sam hit it on the head. This is basic censorship.

Put it this way. Do you think tv shows like Spartacus, Game of Thrones, or True Blood should be banned? What about movies like 300, Black Swan, or American History X? Should they be banned as well? How are they any different?

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

I've never watched any of those shows and the only movie I saw was 300 (which I wasn't impressed enough with to remember much), so I can't really speak to them. I understand the concern for censorship, but I think the issue at hand is social tolerance. I've never been to Australia, but I have to assume their societal standards are different from ours in the US.

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

[BilgeRatBilly]

Hell yeah. Sex, drugs, and rock and roll. Thats what Mario was all about. :rolleyes::cool:

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

Mario was a pimp...

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

[iamthesgt]

It's still their fault. A paper cup of hot coffee belongs in a cup holder, not between your knees.

The court did find them partially responsible. But there was no reason for the coffee to be served anywhere close to that hot.


I'd disagree that one is more acceptable than the other. Is Mario more graphic than CoD? Its an obviously extreme example, but its the basis of your point here.

I don't recall any of that in Mario. But I'd say that yes, violence in the cases I referred to is more acceptable because it proceeds from (albeit somewhat indirectly) a view of war as a necessary evil (probably not the intended message, but one I certainly find) whereas graphic sexual content in games is rooted more out of lust, which I find more destructive than the non graphic violence. You may disagree. Like I said, not someone else's place to impose their views.


How did you find that? Were you doing a research paper?

Lol. Google is your friend. And I have a fairly good memory. No research paper.

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[bobbibot]

[QUOTE=Bull3tBait;136845]This happened when little do-gooders started taking vids of people spanking kids (bad vids where you can't really see what's really going on) and sending them in to news stations who in turn aired them for the world to see (we didnt have youtube in those day. not sure if we even had internet yet). These news stations of course made it look look these parents were beating the living daylights out of the child. This in turn brings out all the "specialists" who say this type of discipline is harmful and causes kids to be psychopaths later in life. Then you have kids that were spanked coming forward saying they were scared for life and a bunch or parents terrified to spank their kids. I saw it unfold on TV and I just knew nothing good was going to come from it.

Speaking of the News...1) News coverage has become far more graphic since Vietnam and I don't just mean television News, I mean Cable, print, and even Radio descriptions. Throw in Twitter, Utube, and any of the other feeds available on the 'net, and we may all access a steady diet of violence in all forms. We are becoming desensitized to violence as a society. This forum is chock full of military people who are trained to complete the mission no matter what may be seen or felt down range. Sorry, I digress...so the News is "real" yet not really "real" to many kids. They see the guts and glory and shiny things on the chests of soldiers. I am not speaking about games such as Grand Theft Auto per se' (although there are many inner city youths that do live similar lives or want to) Military type games such as Call of Duty, Black Ops, Warfighter...do glorify the mission. The problem is sometimes even we don't know what the mission is supposed to be other than our part. With 911 we saw the same scenes repeated in the networks over and over and over again. Movies that have come out afterwards have also kept it alive including O Dark Thirty. I am not defending negligent parents by any means, but war and the "tools of the trade" have entered the living room in a way never seen before in history. Everyone on this forum grew up in a different time- when war was not common place- and assault weapons and other means of violence were not quite so well known. {unless of course you have just turned 20 or are in your early 20's} In brief, it is all a little close and real for kids growing up today. I am also a Southerner...guns are my birthright and I am so not pleased by anyone trying to tell me I cannot have a weapon. The difference is...I was raised with guns and taught to respect them. Videos of street thugs, news stories of war, and movies depicting both street life and war have combined to have children thinking that all they need to be or have "power" is a weapon. If one gets mad- shoot someone. Adding to that- if one is a nobody in school...not a jock, cheerleader, or something like that...but you are a gaming god at home after a zillion hours online...wouldn't it be possible for the line between virtual and real become blurred?

2) Augmented or virtual reality was out of reach until the last few years. Even adults are spending far more time online and immersed in virtual environments. The human mind once immersed has difficulty differentiating what is real and what is virtual. Sherry Turkle (M.I.T.) has written at least 3 books about her concerns of virtual lives. I see it in my work all the time. oooh oooh.. I can't wait for Occulus Rift!!!

3) Parents need to increase their knowledge about technology- including video games- and put forth the effort to monitor and guide their kids.

Just thought I would put my cent and half's worth in mix. It is part of the research I mentioned in my introduction.

[BigFreeze99]

[QUOTE=Bull3tBait;136845]This happened when little do-gooders started taking vids of people spanking kids (bad vids where you can't really see what's really going on) and sending them in to news stations who in turn aired them for the world to see (we didnt have youtube in those day. not sure if we even had internet yet). These news stations of course made it look look these parents were beating the living daylights out of the child. This in turn brings out all the "specialists" who say this type of discipline is harmful and causes kids to be psychopaths later in life. Then you have kids that were spanked coming forward saying they were scared for life and a bunch or parents terrified to spank their kids. I saw it unfold on TV and I just knew nothing good was going to come from it.

Speaking of the News...1) News coverage has become far more graphic since Vietnam and I don't just mean television News, I mean Cable, print, and even Radio descriptions. Throw in Twitter, Utube, and any of the other feeds available on the 'net, and we may all access a steady diet of violence in all forms. We are becoming desensitized to violence as a society. This forum is chock full of military people who are trained to complete the mission no matter what may be seen or felt down range. Sorry, I digress...so the News is "real" yet not really "real" to many kids. They see the guts and glory and shiny things on the chests of soldiers. I am not speaking about games such as Grand Theft Auto per se' (although there are many inner city youths that do live similar lives or want to) Military type games such as Call of Duty, Black Ops, Warfighter...do glorify the mission. The problem is sometimes even we don't know what the mission is supposed to be other than our part. With 911 we saw the same scenes repeated in the networks over and over and over again. Movies that have come out afterwards have also kept it alive including O Dark Thirty. I am not defending negligent parents by any means, but war and the "tools of the trade" have entered the living room in a way never seen before in history. Everyone on this forum grew up in a different time- when war was not common place- and assault weapons and other means of violence were not quite so well known. {unless of course you have just turned 20 or are in your early 20's} In brief, it is all a little close and real for kids growing up today. I am also a Southerner...guns are my birthright and I am so not pleased by anyone trying to tell me I cannot have a weapon. The difference is...I was raised with guns and taught to respect them. Videos of street thugs, news stories of war, and movies depicting both street life and war have combined to have children thinking that all they need to be or have "power" is a weapon. If one gets mad- shoot someone. Adding to that- if one is a nobody in school...not a jock, cheerleader, or something like that...but you are a gaming god at home after a zillion hours online...wouldn't it be possible for the line between virtual and real become blurred?

2) Augmented or virtual reality was out of reach until the last few years. Even adults are spending far more time online and immersed in virtual environments. The human mind once immersed has difficulty differentiating what is real and what is virtual. Sherry Turkle (M.I.T.) has written at least 3 books about her concerns of virtual lives. I see it in my work all the time. oooh oooh.. I can't wait for Occulus Rift!!!

3) Parents need to increase their knowledge about technology- including video games- and put forth the effort to monitor and guide their kids.

Just thought I would put my cent and half's worth in mix. It is part of the research I mentioned in my introduction.
Damn, Bobbibot,
I want the soap box you were standing on... Great points and opinion. I gave you a boost to your rating.

Semper-Fi
Mike

[BilgeRatBilly]

Bobbibot- I think a lot of what you said is very accurate. I'm not a hippy that thinks we should all just get along, but I think we've definitely become desensitized by the access we have.

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

[iamthesgt]

Agreed! Although I couldn't tell where the quote ended and your words began.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[GhostOverride]

[QUOTE=bobbibot;169480]
Damn, Bobbibot,
I want the soap box you were standing on... Great points and opinion. I gave you a boost to your rating.

Semper-Fi
Mike

Think we struck a chord lol...get em Bobbi lmao!

[jgreco138]

The court did find them partially responsible. But there was no reason for the coffee to be served anywhere close to that hot.

They should have blown on it.

[jxspyder]

I've never watched any of those shows and the only movie I saw was 300 (which I wasn't impressed enough with to remember much), so I can't really speak to them. I understand the concern for censorship, but I think the issue at hand is social tolerance. I've never been to Australia, but I have to assume their societal standards are different from ours in the US.

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

Black Swan was critically acclaimed, nominated for 5 acadamy awards, and is best known for its lesbian romance and sex scene between Mila Kunis and Natalie Portman.

American History X, same story. Critically acclaimed, yet brutal scenes.

All three tv shows display excessively graphic sex scenes. Hell True Blood is regularly called vampire porn. The other two have pretty excessive gore as well. All are just as bit deserving of "banning", yet all are both amazingly successful, but acclaimed as well.

I absolutely disagree that its a societal tolerance issue, since the same concepts, images, depictions, and scenes exist in other media outlets.

The issue is bad parenting, the lack of personal accountability, and a system that supports both.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[GhostOverride]

Black Swan was critically acclaimed, nominated for 5 acadamy awards, and is best known for its lesbian romance and sex scene between Mila Kunis and Natalie Portman.

American History X, same story. Critically acclaimed, yet brutal scenes.

All three tv shows display excessively graphic sex scenes. Hell True Blood is regularly called vampire porn. The other two have pretty excessive gore as well. All are just as bit deserving of "banning", yet all are both amazingly successful, but acclaimed as well.

I absolutely disagree that its a societal tolerance issue, since the same concepts, images, depictions, and scenes exist in other media outlets.

The issue is bad parenting, the lack of personal accountability, and a system that supports both.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

^^^agreed

[jxspyder]

As far as that McDonalds suit goes, the original suit was based on the fact that their coffee was like 20 degrees hotter than the industry standard, because they found the smell at that temp boosted sales. Which completely ignored her own accountability in the manner, and is likely a factor in why she settled.

As for the second, his lawsuit is practically unwinnable. But will probably be settled as well.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[BilgeRatBilly]

Black Swan was critically acclaimed, nominated for 5 acadamy awards, and is best known for its lesbian romance and sex scene between Mila Kunis and Natalie Portman.

American History X, same story. Critically acclaimed, yet brutal scenes.

All three tv shows display excessively graphic sex scenes. Hell True Blood is regularly called vampire porn. The other two have pretty excessive gore as well. All are just as bit deserving of "banning", yet all are both amazingly successful, but acclaimed as well.

I absolutely disagree that its a societal tolerance issue, since the same concepts, images, depictions, and scenes exist in other media outlets.

The issue is bad parenting, the lack of personal accountability, and a system that supports both.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

The difference I see from this specific case and your descriptions of the films and shows are concent. People don't have an issue with sex, if they did porn wouldn't be one of the top grossing industries in the world. What people everywhere have issue with is non-consensual sex (aka rape or sexual assault). I'm not arguing violence and gore in games, but sex crimes are kind of in their own category and I'd argue that you could ask just about anyone you know what they think of a rapist and they wouldn't say they wish they could portray one on a video game.

I agree with you and all the others that the biggest part of this "content topic" is bad parenting and no personal accountability. I also really like your last point in that our system supports both of them because its true. But if their country's rating entity says that the content isn't acceptable in any category, I say that's their prerogative.

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

[iamthesgt]

They should have blown on it.

Seriously? No. While there was fault on both sides, the case was decided accurately IMO.


The issue is bad parenting, the lack of personal accountability, and a system that supports both.

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[jxspyder]

The difference I see from this specific case and your descriptions of the films and shows are concent. People don't have an issue with sex, if they did porn wouldn't be one of the top grossing industries in the world. What people everywhere have issue with is non-consensual sex (aka rape or sexual assault). I'm not arguing violence and gore in games, but sex crimes are kind of in their own category and I'd argue that you could ask just about anyone you know what they think of a rapist and they wouldn't say they wish they could portray one on a video game.

I agree with you and all the others that the biggest part of this "content topic" is bad parenting and no personal accountability. I also really like your last point in that our system supports both of them because its true. But if their country's rating entity says that the content isn't acceptable in any category, I say that's their prerogative.

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

Sadly, that only rules out one of the five.

Even more important than consent, is context. And the strength of including such a scene. Boys Don't Cry being another example.

Or, it could be a draw for the hentai tentacle freaks. Thats every big as the porn business.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[jgreco138]

Seriously? No. While there was fault on both sides, the case was decided accurately IMO.
Yeah seriously. You can tell how hot coffee is when you're holding the flimsy paper cup. Otherwise make your coffee at home. You don't deserve $2 mil for being a dumbass.

[iamthesgt]

Yeah seriously. You can tell how hot coffee is when you're holding the flimsy paper cup. Otherwise make your coffee at home. You don't deserve $2 mil for being a dumbass.

She didn't get $2 million. But when you get coffee, you don't expect it to be that hot. You can tell it's hot, but I don't think you can tell the difference between 140 degrees and 180 degrees from the cup. She made a small mistake, which happens all the time. No big deal IF McDonalds had not been willfully negligent.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[jgreco138]

She didn't get $2 million. But when you get coffee, you don't expect it to be that hot. You can tell it's hot, but I don't think you can tell the difference between 140 degrees and 180 degrees from the cup. She made a small mistake, which happens all the time. No big deal IF McDonalds had not been willfully negligent.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

You expect coffee to be hot, and that's what she got. If it were 100 degrees she would have complained it was too cold. If she didn't put it bewteen her knees, it wouldn't have spilled. Case closed.

[iamthesgt]

You expect coffee to be hot, and that's what she got. If it were 100 degrees she would have complained it was too cold. If she didn't put it bewteen her knees, it wouldn't have spilled. Case closed.

You expect it to be hot enough to be uncomfortable if it gets on you or you drink it right away, not cause possibly life-threatening burns (third-degree burns almost instantly over all her lower body). Sure, she could have been a little more careful, but who hasn't spilled a drink in the car?

This is like you buying an electronic device, and one day your house gets a power surge and your device literally explodes. Sure, you could have used a surge protector and unplugged it when you weren't using it, but it was defective to begin with.

Or you're lighting a grill and have the gas on a little too high and it was poorly designed so the flames catch the tank on fire an it explodes. Sure, you should have had the gas a little lower, but that doesn't mean it should blow up!

Oh, and she didn't ask or get $2 million. If you read the article, she only asked for $20,000 (to cover medical bills). We don't know the final award, but it was certainly far less than $2 million.

[jxspyder]

2 mil was, if I remember correctly, the original jury award. Which was lowered by the judge. And then further lowered in an undisclosed settlement.

And yeah, there's absolutely liability on her end. But 185 degree coffee, simply because it sells better, kinda ridiculous.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[jgreco138]

You expect it to be hot enough to be uncomfortable if it gets on you or you drink it right away, not cause possibly life-threatening burns (third-degree burns almost instantly over all her lower body). Sure, she could have been a little more careful, but who hasn't spilled a drink in the car?

This is like you buying an electronic device, and one day your house gets a power surge and your device literally explodes. Sure, you could have used a surge protector and unplugged it when you weren't using it, but it was defective to begin with.

Or you're lighting a grill and have the gas on a little too high and it was poorly designed so the flames catch the tank on fire an it explodes. Sure, you should have had the gas a little lower, but that doesn't mean it should blow up!

Oh, and she didn't ask or get $2 million. If you read the article, she only asked for $20,000 (to cover medical bills). We don't know the final award, but it was certainly far less than $2 million.

Those are bad examples because those are unavoidable defects. This was hot coffee. If she had waited a little longer to drink it, it would have cooled off.

I see this all the time where I work. Soldiers claim their gear was stolen, when in fact they leave it unsecured and someone takes it. That makes them responsible for its theft.

I think we should just agree to disagree on this one...haha. Its a funny thing too, I was watching Seinfeld last night and the hot coffee episode was on. "Who told you to put the balm on? I didn't tell you to put the balm on!".

[iamthesgt]

Those are bad examples because those are unavoidable defects. This was hot coffee. If she had waited a little longer to drink it, it would have cooled off.

I see this all the time where I work. Soldiers claim their gear was stolen, when in fact they leave it unsecured and someone takes it. That makes them responsible for its theft.

I think we should just agree to disagree on this one...haha. Its a funny thing too, I was watching Seinfeld last night and the hot coffee episode was on. "Who told you to put the balm on? I didn't tell you to put the balm on!".

Unavoidable defects? Why? Because they were badly made? Just like the coffee was badly (dangerously) made?

Thievery is an even worse example (aside from the fact that there is no physical injury!) - they leave it out (where they should expect it would get taken if they thought about it), and someone does, as opposed to getting a cup of coffee where there is no reasonable expectation of injury. How many people haven't spilled hot beverages on themselves? Sure, it's annoying, and maybe you got a little red mark (first-degree burns), but when you drink a beverage you expect that maybe if some gets on you, you get hurt and need to change. Not require surgery!

And she wasn't drinking it, she was putting creamer and sugar in it.

I guess we have to disagree. But when you look at the facts, this is cut-and-dried negligence and the jury got it right.

[jxspyder]

Unavoidable defects? Why? Because they were badly made? Just like the coffee was badly (dangerously) made?

Thievery is an even worse example (aside from the fact that there is no physical injury!) - they leave it out (where they should expect it would get taken if they thought about it), and someone does, as opposed to getting a cup of coffee where there is no reasonable expectation of injury. How many people haven't spilled hot beverages on themselves? Sure, it's annoying, and maybe you got a little red mark (first-degree burns), but when you drink a beverage you expect that maybe if some gets on you, you get hurt and need to change. Not require surgery!

And she wasn't drinking it, she was putting creamer and sugar in it.

I guess we have to disagree. But when you look at the facts, this is cut-and-dried negligence and the jury got it right.

Half right. The jury ignored her own negligence. Which is why she didn't get the jury awarded amount.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[jgreco138]

I guess we have to disagree. But when you look at the facts, this is cut-and-dried negligence and the jury got it right.
That's your opinion, I disagree. The jury got it wrong.

[KaNtSt0PMeH]

MERICA!

[jxspyder]

Those are bad examples because those are unavoidable defects. This was hot coffee. If she had waited a little longer to drink it, it would have cooled off.

I see this all the time where I work. Soldiers claim their gear was stolen, when in fact they leave it unsecured and someone takes it. That makes them responsible for its theft.

I think we should just agree to disagree on this one...haha. Its a funny thing too, I was watching Seinfeld last night and the hot coffee episode was on. "Who told you to put the balm on? I didn't tell you to put the balm on!".

Here's the problem with your analogy. This isn't a case in which their gear was stolen because they left it out. This is a case where someone broke in to their house through an open third story window and stole the gear out of the closet.

Theres also a difference between hot coffee and hot coffee. Most places serve coffee at or around 140 degrees. McDonalds was at 185. Solely because it produced the best smell to promote sales. At 185, you will get 3rd degree burns in 2-7 seconds.

While she's absolutely liable for what happened, McD's shares some of that liability.

Oddly, I think this will be the third time Sam and I agree on something. Scary.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[jgreco138]

Here's the problem with your analogy. This isn't a case in which their gear was stolen because they left it out. This is a case where someone broke in to their house through an open third story window and stole the gear out of the closet.

Theres also a difference between hot coffee and hot coffee. Most places serve coffee at or around 140 degrees. McDonalds was at 185. Solely because it produced the best smell to promote sales. At 185, you will get 3rd degree burns in 2-7 seconds.

While she's absolutely liable for what happened, McD's shares some of that liability.

Oddly, I think this will be the third time Sam and I agree on something. Scary.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

You missed the point of my analogy. It's about assuming responsibility for your own actions.

[KaNtSt0PMeH]

While I see the points to accepting responsibility on both sides of the coin, it doesn't matter which method you apply to any situation, there will always be someone who exploits the system. Make something fool-proof and they will just make a better fool. While I refuse to delve too deep into this well-structured argument it's similar to arguing about Religion and/or Politics.

[BilgeRatBilly]

Make something fool-proof and they will just make a better fool.

OMG this ^^^^^

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

[iamthesgt]

Here's the problem with your analogy. This isn't a case in which their gear was stolen because they left it out. This is a case where someone broke in to their house through an open third story window and stole the gear out of the closet.

Theres also a difference between hot coffee and hot coffee. Most places serve coffee at or around 140 degrees. McDonalds was at 185. Solely because it produced the best smell to promote sales. At 185, you will get 3rd degree burns in 2-7 seconds.

While she's absolutely liable for what happened, McD's shares some of that liability.

Oddly, I think this will be the third time Sam and I agree on something. Scary.


That is scary. Quick, someone find something else for us to argue about.


You missed the point of my analogy. It's about assuming responsibility for your own actions.

Which I agree with, and spyder clearly does too. But you are giving McDonald's a free pass for their actions​. There was fault on both sides, but you make it sound like McDonald's had nothing to do with it.

[jxspyder]

You missed the point of my analogy. It's about assuming responsibility for your own actions.

Actually, I'm fairly certain I didn't. You'll notice that pretty much every time I've commented on fault, I've mentioned that the fault was partly hers.

You do seem to have skipped right over my point though.

It's about assuming responsibility for your own actions.

Your words. What about McDonalds responsibility in mitigating potential damage? Do you have any idea how hot 185 degrees is? 2-7 seconds exposure will cause 3rd degree burns. Something McD's was fully aware of. A temperature, by the way, that was used solely because it boosted sales.

So yeah, once again she was absolutely at fault for dumping her coffee.....just like the average joe would be at fault for leaving a window open. But that doesn't change that there is some fault on the part of the guy who climbed through that window as well.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[jgreco138]

Actually, I'm fairly certain I didn't. You'll notice that pretty much every time I've commented on fault, I've mentioned that the fault was partly hers.

You do seem to have skipped right over my point though.

It's about assuming responsibility for your own actions.

Your words. What about McDonalds responsibility in mitigating potential damage? Do you have any idea how hot 185 degrees is? 2-7 seconds exposure will cause 3rd degree burns. Something McD's was fully aware of. A temperature, by the way, that was used solely because it boosted sales.

So yeah, once again she was absolutely at fault for dumping her coffee.....just like the average joe would be at fault for leaving a window open. But that doesn't change that there is some fault on the part of the guy who climbed through that window as well.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

You assume certain responsibilities when you purchase food. Would you sue Dominoes for burning the roof of your mouth on a pizza? What if you placed that slice on your stomache while you were playing a video game and burned yourself, would you sue then?

[jxspyder]

You assume certain responsibilities when you purchase food. Would you sue Dominoes for burning the roof of your mouth on a pizza? What if you placed that slice on your stomache while you were playing a video game and burned yourself, would you sue then?

Can pizza get so hot that 2 seconds contact can cause 3rd degree burns? If no, its an invalid comparison.

Fyi, its no.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[iamthesgt]

You assume certain responsibilities when you purchase food. Would you sue Dominoes for burning the roof of your mouth on a pizza? What if you placed that slice on your stomache while you were playing a video game and burned yourself, would you sue then?

No. But that's different. She didn't try to eat/drink something that she got burned. If I got a minor burn for eating/touching it a little early, that's my fault. However, if I simply touched the box and got third-degree burns, then yeah, I'd sue. There's absolutely no reason for that (ignoring the fact that by the time it's cooked, in the box, and in your hands, it's probably not super hot anyway)

[iamthesgt]

Can pizza get so hot that 2 seconds contact can cause 3rd degree burns? If no, its an invalid comparison.

Fyi, its no.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

^^This. Was pretty much my point as well

[SSG_DrunkEagle]

I have played violent games all my life and I turned out fine. It is all in how u parents raise u I think.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2

[jgreco138]

Can pizza get so hot that 2 seconds contact can cause 3rd degree burns? If no, its an invalid comparison.

Fyi, its no.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

A pizza over is about 500 degrees. I'd say that's hot enough to cause a third degree burn.

[jgreco138]

No. But that's different. She didn't try to eat/drink something that she got burned. If I got a minor burn for eating/touching it a little early, that's my fault. However, if I simply touched the box and got third-degree burns, then yeah, I'd sue. There's absolutely no reason for that (ignoring the fact that by the time it's cooked, in the box, and in your hands, it's probably not super hot anyway)

She wasn't just touching the cup and got burned, she spilled it on herself. I live a block away from a pizza place. When I get a pizza it's extremely hot, but I have sense enough to wait for it to cool off.

[GhostOverride]

:focus:

[jgreco138]

:focus:

Agreed. Obviously you guys aren't going to convince me and I'm not going to convince you either, so I'm ready to drop this.

[KaNtSt0PMeH]

Lol we are all old dogs...

[iamthesgt]

A pizza over is about 500 degrees. I'd say that's hot enough to cause a third degree burn.

No. It's cooked at about 500 degrees. The pizza doesn't get anywhere close to that hot (more like 165 degrees, maybe surface temperature a little more right when it comes out of the oven).

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[KaNtSt0PMeH]

No. It's cooked at about 500 degrees. The pizza doesn't get anywhere close to that hot (more like 165 degrees, maybe surface temperature a little more right when it comes out of the oven).

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

How can you possibly prove that the pizza doesn't get that hot? I would love to see the facts backing that up. This is seriously serving no purpose continuuing on.

[comanche_warior]

That is why I dont get in a debate with spyder.

[jxspyder]

How can you possibly prove that the pizza doesn't get that hot? I would love to see the facts backing that up. This is seriously serving no purpose continuuing on.

Stick a thermometer in it.

When you preheat your oven, does your DiGiornio come out at 350?

If it does, I suggest using it as a black frisbee. :D

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[comanche_warior]

Stick a thermometer in it.

When you preheat your oven, does your DiGiornio come out at 350?

If it does, I suggest using it as a black frisbee. :D

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

Im not arguing or debating but I have worked at a pizza shop and they are pretty damn hot when they come out of the oven but hot that hot.

[BilgeRatBilly]

That is why I dont get in a debate with spyder.

What are you talking about its fun, so long as you don't take it personal :cool:

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

[jxspyder]

What are you talking about its fun, so long as you don't take it personal :cool:

Sent from my van down by the river with my new S4

:beer::D

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[KaNtSt0PMeH]

They were discussing commercial ovens. Which exceed even 500 degrees. Some track based ovens are 700+ and cook pizzas under 5 minutes. So have fun with that thermometer. I guarantee the pizzas get much hotter that 350°… and yes I worked in pizza. Hot enough to melt the soles of my shoes on some days in the kitchen standing around it.

[jxspyder]

They were discussing commercial ovens. Which exceed even 500 degrees. Some track based ovens are 700+ and cook pizzas under 5 minutes. So have fun with that thermometer. I guarantee the pizzas get much hotter that 350°… and yes I worked in pizza. Hot enough to melt the soles of my shoes on some days in the kitchen standing around it.

Yeah, they cook pizzas in 5 minutes. But you're not at 500 degrees in 5 minutes. Otherwise it wouldn't be edible. And not due to the heat. It'd be a piece of charcoal.

As for the Mcadonalds discussion, I sadly did have to do a paper on it. It sucked.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[iamthesgt]

Yeah, they cook pizzas in 5 minutes. But you're not at 500 degrees in 5 minutes. Otherwise it wouldn't be edible. And not due to the heat. It'd be a piece of charcoal.

This.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[BigFreeze99]

It's not the video games that causes violence with our youths.... It's burnt pizza.... geez ... Discussion over.

LOL

[iamthesgt]

It's not the video games that causes violence with our youths.... It's burnt pizza.... geez ... Discussion over.

LOL

Lol I guess this thread did go a little crazy (no crazier than normal, though).

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[GhostOverride]

It's not the video games that causes violence with our youths.... It's burnt pizza.... geez ... Discussion over.

LOL

Burnt pizza is the cause of some many of society's woes....it must be a chemical reaction that takes place once the cheese is overcooked.

[iamthesgt]

Burnt pizza is the cause of some many of society's woes....it must be a chemical reaction that takes place once the cheese is overcooked.

Seriously. If that pizza is all cheesey goodness it's heaven. But if not...someone will lose a body part.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[GermanZ20]

I love reading the last few comments of most of these threads. I look at the topic and see how many comments there are so I'm like, "wow theses guys are having a heated debate about violence in video games." Then I read back 10 posts and they're ALL about pizza!! Smh... You can't tell we're military or anything... Hahaha!


Sent from a lonely island boy using Tapatalk

[iamthesgt]

I love reading the last few comments of most of these threads. I look at the topic and see how many comments there are so I'm like, "wow theses guys are having a heated debate about violence in video games." Then I read back 10 posts and they're ALL about pizza!! Smh... You can't tell we're military or anything... Hahaha!

Hey, food is serious business!

[BigFreeze99]

I love reading the last few comments of most of these threads. I look at the topic and see how many comments there are so I'm like, "wow theses guys are having a heated debate about violence in video games." Then I read back 10 posts and they're ALL about pizza!! Smh... You can't tell we're military or anything... Hahaha!


Sent from a lonely island boy using Tapatalk
Well if I get burnt pizza, I get mad... so I turn on the Xbox and take out my aggravations... thus video games HELPS relieve violence in our society.

[iamthesgt]

Well if I get burnt pizza, I get mad... so I turn on the Xbox and take out my aggravations... thus video games HELPS relieve violence in our society.

Winner winner chicken dinner!

[GhostOverride]

Hey, food is serious business!

Especially pizza...and beer...dont mess with either one or I'm callin my cousin Vinny

[BigFreeze99]

Winner winner chicken dinner!
As long as the chicken isn't burnt...

[jxspyder]

BEER CAN CHICKEN!!

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[iamthesgt]

BEER CAN CHICKEN!!

What is that? I've eaten canned chicken from 1979, but I don't think that's anywhere close to what you're talking about

[jxspyder]

What is that? I've eaten canned chicken from 1979, but I don't think that's anywhere close to what you're talking about

It's not. Beer can chicken is when you shove a beer can up a chicken's ass and grill that bitch.

There's a whole system to it nowadays, with specialty racks and shit. But you'll still find traditionalists who just pop a top and shove it up there before tossing it on the grill. It's surprisingly very good. Or perhaps not so surprisingly.

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[iamthesgt]

It's not. Beer can chicken is when you shove a beer can up a chicken's ass and grill that bitch.

There's a whole system to it nowadays, with specialty racks and shit. But you'll still find traditionalists who just pop a top and shove it up there before tossing it on the grill. It's surprisingly very good. Or perhaps not so surprisingly.

I've never heard of it, but that's not really that surprising, given that I don't like the taste of alcohol (and that I vastly prefer beef and pork to chicken)

[jxspyder]

Not a lot of "alcohol" taste. Is up there with beer brats or tequila tacos.

Sent from the muddy banks of the Wishkaw

[iamthesgt]

Not a lot of "alcohol" taste. Is up there with beer brats or tequila tacos.

Also which I've never tried. I have tried beer-battered onion rings, and they're good. I'd say it's more the fact I don't buy beer and so there's never any to cook with.

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[KaNtSt0PMeH]

You shouldn't drink anyways Sam you are like 12. Lol.

[iamthesgt]

You shouldn't drink anyways Sam you are like 12. Lol.

Haha how do you figure that?

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[GhostOverride]

Also which I've never tried. I have tried beer-battered onion rings, and they're good. I'd say it's more the fact I don't buy beer and so there's never any to cook with.

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Brats boiled in beer and onions are a must before you finish them off on the grill....you will never make them any other way once you do

[BigFreeze99]

What is that? I've eaten canned chicken from 1979, but I don't think that's anywhere close to what you're talking about
Beer Can Chicken.... I submitted that recipe a little while back for the USMG Cookbook..... You will love it...

[iamthesgt]

Brats boiled in beer and onions are a must before you finish them off on the grill....you will never make them any other way once you do

I do love me some onions

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[BilgeRatBilly]

I do love me some onions

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I used to hate them and now I find myself adding more then called for in recipes... It's funny how tastes change with age.

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