Who'd win in a fight?

[MuleTheDestroyer]

I posted this in the Expendables forum but i think that there's enough here for it's own topic. The question was "who would win in a fight" with these Expendables stars, plus Van Damme. Here is the order I put it in if they were in an old school UFC tournament.

here is how that would go, by my ranknings:
#1 Steven Seagal - even fat and out of shape, one of the few legit martial artists on this list
#2 Chuck Norris- acutually think he might be able to take Seagal, I gave it to Seagal though because he has 100 lbs on chuck. Chuck is the only 8th degree black belt in this hemisphere though.. close one
#3 Jackie Chan - getting older, not as fast as Li, but we know that he can take a beating and keep coming (have you seen the outakes for Rumble in the Bronx?)
#4 The Governator - Nothing close to the shape he used to be in, but is still a giant and only has to hit you once.
#5 Sylvester Stalone- 17 Rocky movies must have taught him something
#6 Jet Li - dodge, dip, ducks, dives and dodges, but still a tiny little man.
#7 Jason Straham- fast and strong, and one of the youngerish guys. But I dont see him beating too many of these other guys on this list
# 8 Wesley Snipes - Too old, action isn't his thing anymore
# 9 Dolph Lungrem - i just think that Snipes could take him
#10 Mickey Rourke - I really like him as an actor, not so much in this fight
#11 Jean-claude Van Damme- He's a balet dancer that people in the 80's thought would work in an action movie. Gets crushed and starts to cry 6 seconds into the first round

[XxSilentxFartxX]

Chuck norris @ #2? Are you serious? Chuck norris doesnt get picked for a number the number picks chuck norris.. No way can any of those guys hold a candle to him.. Also you are right about JCVD hes a pussy, Steven segal should be top 3 at least, Jason Statham..Last Dead last. but above JCVD. and if anybody puts That WWE dude that starred in "The Marine" on this list i will freak out like this Guy did: ( with out trying to take the remote in the rear):

[youtube:mljy227v]YersIyzsOpc[/youtube:mljy227v]

[MuleTheDestroyer]

ah ha ha ha haaa
That is the greatest video I have ever seen.

i used to not think that highly of Seagal 'till i saw some of that reality cop show that he does. he looks pretty legit. i would put Chuck up there 'cause it's funny but i don't think he has all that much in submissions. i didn't think too much about the WWF guys until Brock Lesnar came along, now I don't know how to rate any of them. i think you may have a point about Jason Stratham.

[ASignorelli]

HAHAHA! that vid is freaking awesome. but I'd really have to give it to Jet Lee...

[saviger]

chuck Noris

[Aweiha]

OK but let's make this real interesting....consider all of the candidates in their PRIME

[River_Rat_459]

Actually, John Wayne would ride in on his horse, wax all of them with his repeater in one hand, six shooter in the other, and make a wise crack involving "lilly livered sissies".

[MuleTheDestroyer]

In their prime I have for the top three:
1 Chuck
2 Seagal
3 Arnold

[David_3033]

Here is my top four:

1) Randy Couture he has actual MMA experience.
2) Jet Li
tie 3 or 4) Chuck Norris
tie 3 or 4) Seagal

[MAKAVELI x28]

Prime:
1: Couture (MMA fighter)
1B: Chuck
2: Seagal
3: Stallone


Stallone at 3 and not Arnold because I know Stallone can fight or at least has a background in boxing(Rocky). Arnold always needs a gun and this was supposed to be MMA rules.

[MuleTheDestroyer]

Stallone is only 5'7" -5-9" depending on where you look on the internet and Arnold is 6'2" - 6'0". Boxing experience or no, Sly's little arms wouldn't be able to reach the Governator. Not to mention the 75+ lbs he'd be giving away.

And yeah Randy Couture would be able to crush any of them.

[tracker_usmc]

Prime:
1: Couture
2: Chuck
3: Seagal

I would have Mickey Rourke higher on the original list he was a boxer before he was an actor. He left acting in 1991 and returned to professional boxing where he went 8-0 before returning back to acting.

[squidfamily1]

I guess if we're talking mma rules you would have to go with Coutore but in just a straight up street fight you have to say Seagal. The guy didn't spar or submit he just broke your sh@t so fast you didn't have time for a tapout. Plus the guy probably has at least 50 pounds on anyone he would fight now.
Side note: He runs like such a queer you know the dude can fight.

[wick3d_y4yo]

I was under the impression that Segal movies where all sped up to make him look faster than he really was :o

And he's not on the list but I'll watch Bruce Lee wooop EVERYONE'S ass one right after the next!! "Enter the Dragon" BEST movie ever! Sorry for the slight hi-jack...

1)Corture (as long as this was/is an MMA fight) He's going to ground and pound James Toney's a$$ here REAL soon, and he's like 50!
2)Chuck N. (because they once made Chuck Norris toilet paper. It didn't work because it wouldn't take $hit from anyone :shock: )
3)Let's just put them all in a free for all cage match and watch them bit** slap each other till they are red in the face!
4)The governator wouldn't last long. Dude has so much botox his face would pop if he got slapped :shock:

[MuleTheDestroyer]

i just don't know about all them kung-fu, tai kwan do, and ninjitsu guys. they used to be in the UFC 'till around 7 or 8 and always got crushed by everyone. Their tiny, and boxing, kick boxing, wrestling and jujitsu just seem all around better in an actual fight. i get the feeling that the techniques were designed to fight against random thugs, and don't really work against anyone that knows what they are doing. i will take the punch-counter punch science of boxing over Jeet-kun-do anyday.

[Kingpin]

MuleTheDestroyer wrote:

here is how that would go, by my ranknings:
#1 Steven Seagal - even fat and out of shape, one of the few legit martial artists on this list
#2 Chuck Norris- acutually think he might be able to take Seagal, I gave it to Seagal though because he has 100 lbs on chuck. Chuck is the only 8th degree black belt in this hemisphere though.. close one
#3 Jackie Chan - getting older, not as fast as Li, but we know that he can take a beating and keep coming (have you seen the outakes for Rumble in the Bronx?)
#4 The Governator - Nothing close to the shape he used to be in, but is still a giant and only has to hit you once.
#5 Sylvester Stalone- 17 Rocky movies must have taught him something
#6 Jet Li - dodge, dip, ducks, dives and dodges, but still a tiny little man.
#7 Jason Straham- fast and strong, and one of the youngerish guys. But I dont see him beating too many of these other guys on this list
# 8 Wesley Snipes - Too old, action isn't his thing anymore
# 9 Dolph Lungrem - i just think that Snipes could take him
#10 Mickey Rourke - I really like him as an actor, not so much in this fight
#11 Jean-claude Van Damme- He's a balet dancer that people in the 80's thought would work in an action movie. Gets crushed and starts to cry 6 seconds in the first round


I think you need to clarify your list. I agree with your number one choice. However, Chuck Norris is 70 years old now. In his prime. I would put him up against anyone but Bruce Lee. But come on, he's 70...hahaha.

Out of your list. I would put my money on Jet Li kicking everyone ass. He is a legit martial artist. And even though he's a small dude. Force= Mass x Acceleration. And the dude can move his mass very quickly. Bruce Lee was 5 7' and only 135 lb. Yet he could hit harder than most heavy weights because he could punch and kick so fast. Jet Li is 5 5' and 135 lb. So he's about the same size as lee was.

It's funny someone mentioned people were complaining about not being able to catch everything Jet Li did on the movie because he moved so fast. Lee had the same complaints. How they solved it was by filming Lee moving at 3/4 speed and then speeding the film up during editing.

[MuleTheDestroyer]

F does = m x a. You also have to figure in the force and mass required to accelerate the strike, the weight behind, and the follow through. Kung Fu is way overly fancy, with crazy wazu stances and strikes. And overly optimistic combinations. It looks great on film but i dont see Bruce Lee or Jet Li taking on a larger fighter (or actor) with all that much success. Arnold in his prime vs Jet Li in his prime wouldn't even be a contest. Arnold would suplex him into next week, then hold him upside down by his ankle and beat him like a pinate~. i think this video demonstartes my point:

[youtube:20stulji]vfuYVlq9DpU[/youtube:20stulji]

[squidfamily1]

F does = m x a. You also have to figure in the force and mass required to accelerate the strike, the weight behind, and the follow through. Kung Fu is way overly fancy, with crazy wazu stances and strikes. And overly optimistic combinations. It looks great on film but i dont see Bruce Lee or Jet Li taking on a larger fighter (or actor) with all that much success. Arnold in his prime vs Jet Li in his prime wouldn't even be a contest. Arnold would suplex him into next week, then hold him upside down by his ankle and beat him like a pinate~. i think this video demonstartes my point:

[youtube]<object style="height: 344px; width: 425px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/vfuYVlq9DpU"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/vfuYVlq9DpU" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="425" height="344"></object>[/youtube]

I agree, anyone who tells you size doesn't matter, in a fight at least, probably hasn't done much fighting.

[MuleTheDestroyer]

Yay! I finally got the video post done right! 6 attempts later... :?
Computers are hard.

[River_Rat_459]

Ladies and gentlemen, you can officially put this argument to bed. Someone has actually compiled a career kill count for each actor in this movie. By the way....everyone missed the winner: DOLPH FREAKIN' LUNDGREN!

Term Life Insurance unveiled a photo of "The Expendables" cast along with the number of kills the actors have had in their careers. Together, the nine actors have been able to slaughter 1,593 bad guys. And that number doesn't even count Arnold Schwarzenegger's kills.

Topping the list is Dolph Lundgren with 632 kills thanks to a slew of straight to DVD flicks. Sylvester Stallone took second place with 340, the majority of which came from his "Rambo" films. Jet Li and Bruce Willis came close with around 200 kills.

At the bottom of the kills chart is Randy Couture and Terry Crews, each only racking up 2 kills from "The Scorpion King 2" and "Gamer" respectively. Check out the full chart below.

Link to the full size chart is here: http://www.worstpreviews.com/images/...p/temp2280.jpg

The source is here: http://www.worstpreviews.com/headlin...#ixzz0xBXCYqab

[David_3033]

F does = m x a. You also have to figure in the force and mass required to accelerate the strike, the weight behind, and the follow through. Kung Fu is way overly fancy, with crazy wazu stances and strikes. And overly optimistic combinations. It looks great on film but i dont see Bruce Lee or Jet Li taking on a larger fighter (or actor) with all that much success. Arnold in his prime vs Jet Li in his prime wouldn't even be a contest. Arnold would suplex him into next week, then hold him upside down by his ankle and beat him like a pinate~. i think this video demonstartes my point:

[youtube]<object style="height: 344px; width: 425px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/vfuYVlq9DpU"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/vfuYVlq9DpU" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="425" height="344"></object>[/youtube]

I agree, anyone who tells you size doesn't matter, in a fight at least, probably hasn't done much fighting.

Not really true in all cases. Remember Royce Gracie in his prime when he would take on opponents like Kimo Leopoldo and Ken Shamrock. Those guys had to have close to a hundred pounds on him but he still took them out.

[Kingpin]

F does = m x a. You also have to figure in the force and mass required to accelerate the strike, the weight behind, and the follow through. Kung Fu is way overly fancy, with crazy wazu stances and strikes. And overly optimistic combinations. It looks great on film but i dont see Bruce Lee or Jet Li taking on a larger fighter (or actor) with all that much success. Arnold in his prime vs Jet Li in his prime wouldn't even be a contest. Arnold would suplex him into next week, then hold him upside down by his ankle and beat him like a pinate~. i think this video demonstartes my point:

[youtube]<object style="height: 344px; width: 425px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/vfuYVlq9DpU"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/vfuYVlq9DpU" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="425" height="344"></object>[/youtube]

I agree, anyone who tells you size doesn't matter, in a fight at least, probably hasn't done much fighting.

Not really true in all cases. Remember Royce Gracie in his prime when he would take on opponents like Kimo Leopoldo and Ken Shamrock. Those guys had to have close to a hundred pounds on him but he still took them out.

Well said. I would like to add to that.

Size can matter. But not in all cases. Lots of big dudes think they can fight just by virtue of their size. But if they run up against a trained fighter. I put my money on the trainer fighter. I think Mule said "Arnold would Kill Jet Li". I really don't think Arnold would stand a chance against Jet Li. Arnold has not been trained to fight. Jet Li would probably just side kick Arnold in the knee breaking it. Or kick him in the groin, finger jab him in the eye, or take his throat out. Then Arnold's size means nothing.

If your talking about two equally trained guys (or just two regular dudes) then I would say the bigger guy has the advantage.

I've been involved in martial arts since I was 12. And I've been involved in fights in and out of the ring. I can tell you size means nothing if you don't know how to use it. I have been in fights against dudes who out weighed my by at least 80 pounds. I'm talking steroid taking meat heads. I dropped them in less than 5 seconds with a quick kick to the groin as soon as they got in range. When your on the floor throwing up. Size means nothing. I had another guy actually get his hands on me who was bigger and stronger than me. I snapped his index finger. He let me go. As soon as he did. I kicked him in the head. Fight over. In both cases, these were big stupid dudes who thought they were tough because they were big. Their size did not help them against a trained fighter.

A good example is recently a UFC (Hurea-sp) fighter beat the shit of this dude in front of a night club for beating up a women. This dude out weighed the professional trained fighter by at least 100 lbs and was scary looking. I would have hated to tackle this guy. The UFC fighter drop him in less than 3 seconds.

[ASignorelli]

agreed JET LI WINS!

[MuleTheDestroyer]

Few things to respond to:
1. In current UFC rules you can't kick people in the balls, no small joint manipulation, and eye gouging has never been allowed.
2. Joyce Gracie won because he used brazillian jujitsu. Jet Li does not. Kung Fu is one of the losingist martial arts in the octagon. Turns out it doesnt work so well.
3. Jet Li is not a cage fighter. He practiced Wu Shu (non-sparring) up until he was 17, and has been doing movies ever since. Wu Shu competitions are more like a dance off then a martial arts tournament. They have a choreographed "fight" routine that they go through and are judged on the speed timing and precision of their forms.

[Kingpin]

Few things to respond to:
1. In current UFC rules you can't kick people in the balls, no small joint manipulation, and eye gouging has never been allowed.
2. Joyce Gracie won because he used brazillian jujitsu. Jet Li does not. Kung Fu is one of the losingist martial arts in the octagon. Turns out it doesnt work so well.
3. Jet Li is not a cage fighter. He practiced Wu Shu (non-sparring) up until he was 17, and has been doing movies ever since. Wu Shu competitions are more like a dance off then a martial arts tournament. They have a choreographed "fight" routine that they go through and are judged on the speed timing and precision of their forms.

Ok. Fair enough. But I didn't really see where you were talking about these dudes fighting under UFC rules. It has sort of digressed into "who would win in a fight". I still feel under UFC rules Arnold would not win against Jet Li. At least Jet Li has been trained to fight.

Your right, his style is more like dance. And in my opinion Kung Fu isn't very effective in real fighting situations. But Arnold has had no fight training. And if we are going under UFC rules these two dudes wouldn't even fight. They would be in different weight classes.

The more important question is who was a better captain? Picard or Kirk....hahaha